Company of Heroes

Hey guys, what's up. First of all, let's get to know each other. I am Stefan, i'm 18, and I am here to teach you guys how to play CoH. I am lv 11, although I can easily get 12, and probably 13, but I simply don't have much time to play anymore. Anyway, please state your goals as a mentee, and I will do my best to help you two achieve them. In order for this program to yield the best results, I need you guys to post replays, both wins and losses, as well as ask questions frequently.

Now I am in all AP courses so my time is limited and varied. I will try my best to post as often as I can, but please don't get angry if I don't write a review of a replay or respond to a question within one hour. Usually I will respond within a day's time.

sjceran

Hi Guys,

First of all, sjceran thaks for mentoring!! My name is Chris, I'm 37 and Coh is basically the 2nd RTS I've ever played. The first was SC, but I never played that online. SO, I'm pretty new to the RTS way of thinking and playing, especially when you have to work so fast to manage units all over the map. As a result I have pretty poor micro and lose units needlessly. I really need help in reading my opponent and appropriate counters, as my play is mostly reactive without much anticipation.

I pretty much only play vCoH factions, am lvl 7 and under .500 with both . I find I can beat most players lower than me or at my level, but get absolutely crushed by lvl9s or higher. I play maybe 4 nights a week, after 9-9:30 EST after the kid (and wife) go to sleep, so I don't expect a quick turnaround with replays or replies.

I'll post a replay of my most recent game, which was probably one of the best games I've played recently. My relic acct name is: DerTeufel

Thanks again, I appreciate you spending your time and look forward to learning form you!

Chris

P.S. MrN1ce9uy, if possible maybe we can try to play each other so sjceran won't have to watch so many replays....

Watsup guys,

My name is John I am 18 and I am currently awaiting leaving for basic training in the USAF.(Hopefully it won't be too much longer, I've been waiting for months ) I play mostly strategy/war games. I actually haven't even touched CoH in about a week and a half (been playing 14-day free trial of WWII Online ), but now that I have a mentor I will be playing as much as possible Thanks sjceran!

I am lvl 7 with Wehr which is my favorite army. (I did get to lvl 8 about 3 or 4 games ago, but then I lost the very next game and it put me back at lvl 7) I'm lvl 6 with PE(which is my second favorite army) and I don't really play with allies much but I am willing to play and learn with them. And chriskaz, that sounds good I'm up for playing against you, just let me know before hand(like the day before or each morning) when you are planning on playing and I will most likely be able to be online then.

My goal is to gain experience and knowledge in-game to where I can make it past lvl 10. Or better yet my goal is to learn everything you know about CoH sjceran

I have several replays already of me losing and winning I'll go look at them and maybe post them in a bit.

Edit* Okay I got some replays. Don't ask me what I was thinking in the jagdisk replay lol I had complete control so I thought, but then I just stopped attacking for some reason and started playing defensively which ended in me losing.

And the one with Warz, lol I was just kinda making that up as I went. It wasn't planned out like that but I skipped T1 and went straight to T2. It actually worked out well but I just couldn't execute a successful attack.

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This post has been edited by MrN1ce9uy: Nov 24 2008, 14:11 PM

Hey guys, nice to meet you

Chris and John, that would be great if you two could play each other and post the relays, that would deal with 2 items at once. I will try to get you the replays reviewed by Wednesday. I usually do a thorough review, but I focus on the main points that lost you the game. lol but if there are any major flaws I will just point them out

Add me to your friends list, my main is sjceran. My smurfs are secret I haven't been on RO for a while, but I will try to get on as often as possible for you two.

(I have the worst connection in all of the community, so it limits my playing time. Funny story about my connection, I once had a 17-0 smurf, lv 9 ~900 position and I was playing some lv 5 guy. It was an easy win on ango but my connection went out and I lost my streak, and fell to lv 8 and ~1900 )

Now for replays, try to limit your posts to games where you lost or won by a narrow margin. If you simply lost because of a noticable error, like building the wrong building, you played a lv 20, or something along those lines, don't post, unless it is funny
I will try to find some of my old replays to give you examples. (I don't have many left because I cleared out most of my old files)

I will try to help you guys out to the best of my ability. Lv 7-9 is the tipping point, or the hurdle for most CoH players. Once we get past that we will be golden.

Sounds great

I'm fixing to log on to RO and will be probably be on and off up until later tonight.

So me and chriskaz played a couple matches tonight, we decided the first wasn't worth posting because there were way to many obvious mistakes on chriskaz part

But we finally got a good game that we can post up so that you can review it

I'm not too proud of this one but it'll do But anyways have a look and tell us what you think.

*Edit: The first game we played everything was going smooth for me and I was more relaxed, but the second game I made a few mistakes and I was on the edge of my seat from the very beginning lol Which caused me to do a bit of irrational thinking(happens to me often). But that just made me realize how different each game can play out.

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This post has been edited by MrN1ce9uy: Nov 25 2008, 06:08 AM

OUCH, thanks MRN1ce9uy

At least I got some revenge, although barely. I think you could have won it if you had harassed and capped the lefthand side some more, as I was hurting for MP trying to hold that bottom-left VP.

I'll try to be on again tonite, but I can never gaurantee something doesn't come up (like the wife asking me to do something

Chris

Ok guys I watched your replay where you played each other. I have all of the notes down, I just need to write it up. I will have it by tomorrow, since it was a fairly large write up There are a few big concepts we have to get down for you guys to reach higher levels. Overall you guys played well, but there were significant mistakes, on both sides, which prevented either one of you from receiving a quick win.

I have a slightly different setup than your other reviews. I am doing a play-by-play of both of your playstyles. I watched the replay twice, once for each side, so I could get every good and bad move for both of you guys.

Here is the review

---John---
0:50- good capping order
3:50- Lost Volks squad. This could have easily been gg vs a high rank player. Never let a major unit die within the first 20 minutes if you can.
5:40- Saw the engie squad make a mine, ran into it. Try to avoid that and get a minesweeper.
6:45- Pio should be capping. Becareful, that could be the difference between a win and a loss if it happens a lot.
7:40- Let a nearly dead riflesquad escape. Hunt them down with your volks.
***Game Changing Moment***
**10:20- Retreat that mg squad. It was flanked and naded, then you lost the mg Once you see a flank coming, pull back or retreat.
*Under the circumstances of that game, a med bunker would have really helped you. Ango is a small map, so the medics have a seemingly larger range. You lost a lot of units and manpower early game, which would have yielded at least 2 gren squads. If you go t2, a med bunker should be up before 10 minutes.
*Against BARs you should get vet 2 infantry. It will really help you against the BARs offensive power.
11:50- Pick a squad. You should have engaged the 2 flame engies rather than the full health BAR riflemen. The more units you can kill the better.
13:15- retreat the whole group from the M8. You almost lost a full grenadier squad for nothing. It is better to retreat, keep the manpower, and then come back and attack.
14:00- Crawl bug with volks squad. To fix that, constantly right-click near the squad until they stand up.
15:00- the mortar is not a frontline unit. Keep it at range, behind the frontlines to keep it safe.
15:30- That is why you cannot blob, so to speak. You need to keep units spaced out so one arty round won't take out 8 units. In that situation, you should have anticipated an arty shot or a strafe run. Watch for smoke!!! When you see it retreat.
16:35- Retreat the mg from the building. It was an unnecessary loss, which affected the later game.
17:00- Get T4 out by now, floating 150 fuel!!! By 20 minutes, a good T2 strat will have a P4 or ostwind out wreaking havoc.
18:00- I am sorry, but that was the worst possible flak position possible.
***By now you should have made a spare squad (pio, volks, or gren) to capture the left side. don't expect to capture the whole side, but you do need to take as much territory as you can.
19:48- Repair the bunker...oh wait, the flak destroyed it
21:00- Good idea to clear the hedges, but once the enemies come in, stop auto-firing. I am not sure whether it was beneficial to clear the hedges tbh. You allowed a larger firing arc, but you also allowed Chris to attack with a larger battefield, rather than being channeled between the hedges.
23:20- get that motorbike moving!
24:00- collect the scattered ammo, such as schrecks and mortars.
25:00- Be sure to listen for artillery. Once you hear it keep your units moving.
27:00- Finally T4 It was too late to make a difference though.
***Possible chance for a win***
The last 13 minutes of the game were close. I thought you were going to be able to win, or at least make it closer. Since Chris had a lot of infantry, and only 1 sherman, an ostwind along with the 2 P4's would have been a great combo. You should have built a counter sniper, or at least tried to kill his Howitzer. That howie really hurt your units. Watch your tank micro. You barged into his base without scouting. You should have used the P4's to push foward, or at least cap the left side.
40:00- Bunker problem again Don't build in front of the flak.

Overall, not capping the left side, unit losses, late t4, lack of early veterency, and some obvious mistakes (flak 88 placement) cost you the game.







___Chris___
1:00 awkward capping order. I will give you some examples of more efficient CO's soon.
3:15- Get that cut-off sooner. You have a rifle squad coming so you don't have to wait.
3:50- Focus fire!! Select all of your rifles to attack one squad, therefore they will fall down in seconds rather than spreading the damage across both squads.
4:45- once you place a mine try to move your engie squad asap. Otherwise you may give away the position.
5:00- nice cap
7:15- Pull that riflesquad back!! Losing a riflesquad early is a game changer.
8:33- Micro issue. Don't let that rifle squad follow the retreating squad. You lost some manpower and time from a simple mistake.
9:40- I wasn't sure whether you used supressing fire or it was just a lucky supression. If it was SF, that was a waste of munitions. The best time to use SF is against a blob, or while the riflesquad is in a building.
11:08- watch the flame engies
11:57- very nice grenade
15:30- you lost a unit, but balanced it out with a very good arty shot.
***Mid-game***
At this point you should start a TD, or get the first upgrade from the Supply Depot. I noticed you said that you were having some manpower problems at the end, you should have purchased the Supply Depot upgrade to alleviate some of the upkeep costs. Be sure to replace lost units, like rifle squads or engie squads too.
16:48- Be sure to kite your M8. You lost the M8 to small arms fire, which could have easily been prevented by pulling back your M8.
18:30- nice to see the sniper
22:00 another good arty shot
24:00- Repair that M8 so it can be put to use. At this point you had about 500 munitions so you could do a little trick I like to do. You should have gone into John's base with the M8 to scout what he is building, but also plant M8 mines in the doorways of the buildings. For example, planting a mine in front of a Wehr T4 building would definitely damage the engine of whatever tank came out.
26:40- pull that sherman back faster. It cannot stand up against a flak and a shreck squad.
30:00- this is what you have to be careful of during a match. You almost let the game slip. If you were playing a lv 10+ the game would have turned. You started to get a little sloppy and lost a bunch of units.
**If you buy the ranger upgrade get in close, and I mean right next to the enemy squads, for the best results.
35:00 Don't arty your base
36:00- Once again, pull back that sherman quicker. It got that one P4, but it will not take out the other head on.
38:00- try to repair the AT guns when you have a chance. It is a lot cheaper than building a new one.
39:48- Lost a ranger squad.

Overall, a strong start, lots of resources, nice mine usage, all tiers used, and arty gave you the win. Be sure to get the supply depot upgrade next time, it really does help your manpower. Watch your sherman micro, and get damaged vehicles repaired.

I will be going over the basic concepts of playing CoH, for both factions tomorrow. I am a sick at the moment so I am a bit tired, so sorry for any gramatical or spelling errors

GG to both of you, though. When my internet stops sucking, I will try to get on RO to play some games with you guys.

This post has been edited by sjceran: Nov 26 2008, 01:24 AM

Wow, nice review man

I kinda noticed most of my mistakes after watching the replay myself. I also didn't realize that he was so low on units and MP in the late-game. I kept from attacking because I feared I didn't have enough units to take out what he had on the field.

I do have some questions though, first I would like to ask what type of places are good spots for 88's? Maybe further back behind my defenses?

You had a good spot for the flak, but you built the bunker first. Placing the flak right behind the bunker is not the best idea. In that case I would have put the 88 to the left of the bunker, so it would be able to fire straight without a problem. If you didn't have the bunker in front of the flak, it would have been a great spot.

Honestly, I think you would have been better off with a terror doctrine for the KT choice rather than defensive. You did not have a early game bunker so the defensive operations wasn't too beneficial.

But a good place to place a flak is in a wide open area with a large firing arc.

This post has been edited by sjceran: Nov 26 2008, 01:41 AM

Awesome review! Thanks - extremely helpful. Iive always had trouble with vehicle micro, and therefore I tend to lose games inthe mid-game period.

ALso you pointed oiut two things I tend not to think about: 1) I didn't even think to get the SD upgrade, that definitely would of helped! and 2) using M8 mines always slips my mind

I have a stupid question about focus fire. I tend to drag-select my 2-3 squads and then click on the squad I want them to target, but I'm not sure this always works. Do you have to tell each squad individually which one to fire at?

That is a good question. Usually you can drag click multiple squads and then click on the squad you want to kill. The problem with that is sometimes they run out of cover. If my units are blobbed together I will just drag select all of them and fire on one squad. If my units are fairly far apart, i will just click each squad individually, but they will all fire on the same target. Just be sure not to lose any squads.



**Note: Happy Thanksgiving guys. Enjoy tomorrow, but if you guys want, I think I will be on a good prtion of tomorrow. Probably from 10-5 eastern I will be off and on RO, so perhaps we can play a few matches together.

Edit: Here is the game John and I played today. Since you are a more US based player, this will help you out chris. Now I wasn't going all out, i was mainly testing your micro and decision making abilities to get a better feel of how your playstyle works and what needs to be improved.

Chris, you see once I got the SD upgrade i was floating tons of manpower towards the end

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This post has been edited by sjceran: Nov 26 2008, 20:11 PM

Thanks Stefan. Happy Thanksgiving to you guys also!!!
I won't be able to be on RO tomorrow until late in the evening as usual, and I'll be away for the weekend until Sunday.

I'm also interested in learning to play Wehr (and to a lesser extent PE) better. I end up playing US more because it seems more people choose Axis and I always try to get the quickest automatch by choosing the side with less people.

*edit: I watched the replay of you and mrniceguy, and thought I'd mention one or two things I would have done differently if I were mrniceguy so I can see if my thinking/analysis is on the right track. One big thing I think would have helped was to build a pak right after his first gren squad instead of going with the mortar. He might have been able to take out the M8 earlier...
Another thing would have been to get another MG mid-game to try to suppress your rifles so his 3-4 squads of volks & grens could take on the remaining squads or force a retreat. THe problem with this is that you had a sherman by this point, but it still might have given him some breathing room to get a couple shreck shots off (plus the pak). Not sure what else, these two things might have reduced his reinforce costs, and allowed him to take a little more of the map and dig in when you retreated. Does this sound like a reasonable analysis? If not, I'm in worse shape than I thought

This post has been edited by chriskaz: Nov 27 2008, 16:21 PM

Hey sjceran,

Two more replays of games between Mrniceguy and I. One good game, one not so good (for me) where I simply lost too many squads needlessly - especially an early volks.

Hope you had a great Thanksgiving! As I mentioned before, I'll be away for the weekend, so no rush for replay reviews...

Thanks once again for your mentoring help!

Watsup guys,

Yeah I'm not too proud of those two replays either . But I just got dun playing an automatch game and it really sucked lol. I say that because this PE player just pulled a cheap move when I went WSC start and rushed my base with his IHT and a couple gren squads which left me with no way of defending my own base. The only way I think I could have prevented it is by placing more mines around my base entrances. Anyways heres the replay along with a couple other of me playing as US. You don't have to review them Stefan I would just like you to watch them.

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That is a solid analysis The only problem with the mg is that I am great at flanking


I did thank you, stuffing ftw. I hope both of you had a great thanksgiving also. I will be really busy this weekend so I am aiming for Tuesday for the reviews


I will review at least one, but thank you If I see you on RO I will whisper you the review, otherwise I will just post them here.

Sorry guys, I am falling a bit behind on the reviews. I was going to do it yesterday but I ended up doing 8 hours of yard work I have the first 3 reviewed, I just need to type it up. I am not at my normal computer though so I will hopefully get them typed up by tonight.

But I think I need to start giving you some lessons on CoH playing for all armies, to help you guys out a bit more.

Hi Stefan, no need to apologize, we are all busy. I have yardwork that absolutely needs to be done today - and its pouring outside . I'd like to play you sometime also, but with work and the kid, I am not able to get online until between 9:30 & 10pm. Any way this would work for you sometime? I got crushed last week by a lvl13 wehr on Beau, which I thought was supposed to be a tough map for wehr



Even going with a standard rifle start, this is diffcult to stop. I've only beaten this rush once, and that was by basically capping the rest of the map and holding out for rangers or airborne. You end up with a lot of MP. I just kept pumping out rifles and sent them off capping. Once I had hte map, I retreated them all and stuck them in my HQ. Maybe this would have worked with MGs, build a couple, stick them in your HQ and the IHT won't last long. Once it goes down it's gg because he has so little of the map and resources.

Yeah I've been really busy the past few days also. I haven't even logged onto RO since Friday. But I'm planning on getting on tomorrow night hopefully.

Hey Guys,
Is there some new American strat I don't know about? I lost 2/3 matches today as wehr against essentially the same strat. Starts with 3-4 engies and WSC and gets like 2-3 MGs. This gets them map control, and they get a mortar followed by rangers. It's hard once the MGs are setup to flank them as wehr. Barracks follows and rifles+rangers clean up what little fo the map you have. The rest of the games were me just trying to hold on vs lots of arty barrages....
I tried defensive, terror and blitz, only defensive worked, but barely. In both losses, I skipped T3 and went for tanks, but betwen the rangers and AT guns, it didn't help much.
So essentially, sjceran, how does one beat a WSC start followed by rifles by a decent player??

*edit: I think I figured it out - T3-blitz seems like it would work best by using a couple pumas....

This post has been edited by chriskaz: Dec 1 2008, 13:06 PM

Well, t3 would definitely work, all you need to do is avoid those rangers and AT guns. If you skip straight to t4, an Ostwind with P4 support would do wonders. But in reality, the limited resources would probably force you to go a T1+T2 route. For that, you simply need to make a sniper, or two, a mine sweeper pioneer squad, 1 volks squad, 1-2 mg squads, then get a mortar and gren squads.

If you have good flanking skills, get a flame pioneer squad, two if you could, with a volks squad and execute a flank similar to a US riflemen+ flame engie flank

As far as I know, it seems to be a spin off of the 4Es strategy. A lot of people have been trying to prove that a wsc start works in the strat forums. It does work, but you take a risk with that start which is much greater than a Barracks start.

BTW, do you have the replays of that?


I would if I could, but my internet literally goes off everyday at 4:50 pm. It is the most annoying thing in the world and I don't know why. Occasionally it will go on around 6-7, but it is almost always off by 9. The wireless network that was unsecured, which I use to use to go on late night, became secure so I really have no way to get on. I will try my best to get on but it isn't in my control


Well, as stated above, going wsc is a huge risk and really doesn't work well. I always go rifles since they are so versatile. This happened to me before, a lot in the 2.201 patch when HT's were OP. I am going to watch the replay and give you a review.